file Timeouts in Finals: Do they happen too often?

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Poll: Timeouts in Finals: Do they happen too often? (was ended 0000-00-00 00:00:00)

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26 Oct 2012 15:45 #39806 by Ohlmann

Well, except that stalling is illegal.


Obvious stalling is illegal.

Non-obvious and non-obnoxious stalling, like not playing fast, taking 2 minute instead of 90 second on important actions, and more importantly turtling without forward action is legal, if only because undistinguishable from someone a bit stressed and/or tired.

Of course, if we have only the top seed that can do that instead of every finalist which have a reasonable hope for one vp before the end of the game, it will still lead to less stall.

Online magic had a system where each player had its own clock, which runned only when the player had a decision to make. It was pretty efficient, but it's a pain in the ass to do in real life.

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27 Oct 2012 11:17 #39813 by KevinM

Aside from judges giving out slow-play warnings is there anything that can be done to give players incentive to play faster?

Sure: Find judges that are willing to act like JUDGES, and after a warning for slow -- or "slower than normal" -- play, start adding time to the clock.

I played in a final recently where, near the end, I began playing slower than the rest of the players. The judge had been timing everyone's play and when mine got out of sync, he gave me a warning and said that he would start adding time to the clock. I disputed it for about 5 seconds, because I didn't think that I had been doing so, but he showed me the timer and I said "damnit!" and I sped up my play. I won the tournament.
:)

It's completely anecdotal and I haven't researched the subject, but since I'm not saying anything new at this point, and I don't wish to dispute my good friend Emiliano any further ;) perhaps it's best just to end my participation with this thought: Having been to only one EC, but having played with and judged dozens of European players -- both here in the US *and* at the EC, and at *all levels* of event-type, from "local" to the NAC itself -- I have noticed that European players have a MUCH greater tendency to dispute/argue with the judge. Perhaps it's this belief of mine that is making me suggest that Emiliano's issues are "local". Just a thought; I could be wrong.

Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/
Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017

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27 Oct 2012 11:18 - 27 Oct 2012 11:25 #39814 by KevinM

Obvious stalling is illegal. Non-obvious and non-obnoxious stalling, like not playing fast, taking 2 minute instead of 90 second on important actions, and more importantly turtling without forward action is legal, if only because undistinguishable from someone a bit stressed and/or tired.

With all due respect, that's complete and utter bullshit. Stalling is stalling, and stalling is illegal.

If you are unable to identify that a player is stalling, you are, quite simply, unfit to be a judge.

It may be that in your local area, everyone is at about the same skill level in terms of judging, and in those cases -- which I think are probably more hypothetical than real -- you do the best you can with what you have. In a "qualifier"- or "championship"-level tournament, you step out of the way and allow people who have shown the ability to judge properly and well to be in charge.

Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment...Complacency...Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Please visit VTESville daily! vtesville.myminicity.com/
Facebook: www.facebook.com/groups/129744447064017
Last edit: 27 Oct 2012 11:25 by KevinM.

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27 Oct 2012 11:32 - 27 Oct 2012 11:33 #39815 by Boris The Blade

Well, except that stalling is illegal.

Who said anything about stalling? Offering your Powerbase: Montreal around, rushing crosstable anyone who starts to get an edge, vote pool damage votes down, crosstable DIs/Delaying/Suddens,... There are plenty of ways to slow down a table that do not involve trying to decrease the actual number of turns that people can play in 2 hours.
Last edit: 27 Oct 2012 11:33 by Boris The Blade.

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27 Oct 2012 13:40 #39821 by Izaak
That's not stalling. If you manage to do that and win the tournament because of it, you're playing with fish.

Which, given the decks I see at final tables in some smaller tournaments may well be the case.

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