Action Cards, Angel of Berlin, On the Qui Vive, and Determine

Non-existant user wrote:

Brum wrote:

You guys are missing the point:
I can play DI (Master Out of Turn), but not AoB (another MOoT).

Only because the DI card text explicitely tells you to play it at that time.

I don't want to be an ass (I'm just trying to understand all the phenomena here), but there are lots of effects that don't specify when they can be used and by default that means you can use them whenever you want.
Regretfully I only remember effects of things that are on the table, like tapping the Coven or Dreams (put 1 pool on an uncontrolled vampire).

Pascal - is this because there's a difference between the timing in using effects on the table and playing cards?

The "as played" window is special: by default, you cannot play anything there (including Coven or Dreams), with 2 exceptions:
-cancel effects, that all have it on their card text,
-wakes, because the rulebook 1.6.1 says so without defining properly what "grant the ability to play" means.

It seems counter intuitive but it works because this game was structures around the time of Magic the Gathering, but before MtG switched to stacking resolution. So there's a bit of legacy mechanics that leaves confusion. Basically it's opening the same arguments about Interrupts and what defines them and when they are playable. VtES being a game sorely lacking keyword terms to simplify this process doesn't help these arguments (but leaves such a colorful display of functioning chaos in its wake).

Basically "Wakes" are Interrupts, because the "as though it were untapped" clause is an effect that backtracks the state into a targeting allowance window for both Instant and Interrupt effects. Because of this Interrupt opening, Determine's card Cancelling Interrupt effect is allowed to proceed.

Angel of Berlin has no such clause. It clearly provides one effect, but does not Interrupt play to allow other Interrupting effects to enter. It is an Instant effect. So the playing of the Action card has its window open and close without interruption, with Angel of Berlin Instant effect following. And then at that point Determine's Cancelling Interrupt effect has nothing to target.

Better? Gawd, I miss those befuddling halcyon days of MtG where we'd argue over interrupt timing... Brings back good memories. Probably another reason I still play VtES, its agony nostalgia.