lightbulb Rulebook: Potentially misleading and oddly placed passages

30 Jul 2021 16:52 - 30 Jul 2021 20:31 #102825 by Hobbesgoblin
I found a couple of misleading and wweird phrases in the rulebook that need fixing in my opnion.

ADVANCED RULESSome cards have a burn option icon.This icon means that a Methuselah who does not control a minion that meets the requirements of this card may discard it during ANY Methuselah’s unlock phase and replace it.Each Methuselah is limited to one such discard each unlock phase.For each card and title you are contesting, you must choose to yield or to pay to contest it.

This sems to be in the wrong place, should that not be inside the box below, or in it'S own box after both contest cases?

Contested Titles
[...]
If more than one vampire in play claims the same title, then the title is contested.

This can be read as that two cardinals, primogen etc would contest. There needs to be a "unique" here.

If a single minion has two or more different mandatory actions, then they are “stuck” and cannot perform any action (this does not prevent your other minions from performing actions, however).

Should be "If a single minion can't perform a mandatory action or has two [...]
Aka the "change of target on a mandatory hunt" rule.

2. Resolve Any Block Attempts
Stealth and Intercept

[...]
Note that all modifications made to a minion’s stealth or intercept remain in effect for the duration of the action. Increased stealth and intercept return to normal after the action is resolved.

Stealth and intercept can be below 0 due to cards and effects, this also resets to the default value.

Combat
5. Damage Resolution

[...]
ADVANCED RULESAllies and retainers treat aggravated damage the same as normal damage. For each point of damage successfully inflicted on a minion or retainer, they burn 1 life counter. A minion or retainer who loses all of their life counters is burned.

Should be Ally.
Last edit: 30 Jul 2021 20:31 by Hobbesgoblin.
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30 Jul 2021 20:32 #102827 by Hobbesgoblin
I just discoverd a second occurance of "Minion" that should be "Ally" in the last quaoted paragraph.
I edited the post accordingly.
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04 Aug 2021 11:43 - 04 Aug 2021 12:53 #102858 by Joscha
From Clarifications in the V5-Rulebook:

Deep Song - "At superior, if the action is not blocked, the target minion is considered to be the acting minion: ..."
Deep Song sup works only against vampires, not minions.

"Frenzy. d Enter combat with and lock a vampire. The target vampire is considered the acting minion during that combat."

Baron of Frankfurt
Last edit: 04 Aug 2021 12:53 by Joscha.

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17 Oct 2021 14:17 #103577 by Hobbesgoblin
More misleading passages:

During a bleed action, a minion cannot play more than one action modifier card to increase the bleed amount. This rule is reminded on those cards by the “(limited)” card text.


Contradicts the glosssary:

Limited: Some cumulative effects are forbidden by the rules. For instance, no more than one action modifier card can be played to increase a bleed during a bleed action. Similarly, a minion cannot use more than one card or effect (a source) to gain additional strikes per round of combat. Those rules are reminded on those cards by the “(limited)” card text. (See Bleed and Additional Strikes).


This first phrasing implies, that a minion who took over the action with "mask of a thousand faces" can play additional limited bleed modifiers, or that several minions can play "empowering the puppet king" into the same action, wich is both not possible according to my knowlege, and with the wording in the glossary.

Mask of a thousand faces

Empowering the Puppet King

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20 Oct 2021 08:58 #103611 by inm8

More misleading passages:

During a bleed action, a minion cannot play more than one action modifier card to increase the bleed amount. This rule is reminded on those cards by the “(limited)” card text.


Contradicts the glosssary:

Limited: Some cumulative effects are forbidden by the rules. For instance, no more than one action modifier card can be played to increase a bleed during a bleed action. Similarly, a minion cannot use more than one card or effect (a source) to gain additional strikes per round of combat. Those rules are reminded on those cards by the “(limited)” card text. (See Bleed and Additional Strikes).


This first phrasing implies, that a minion who took over the action with "mask of a thousand faces" can play additional limited bleed modifiers, or that several minions can play "empowering the puppet king" into the same action, wich is both not possible according to my knowlege, and with the wording in the glossary.

Mask of a thousand faces

Empowering the Puppet King


Agree with the above.



My contribution for possible re-wordings:

For the bleed section:
During a bleed action, an action modifier card that would increase the bleed amount cannot be played if one is already doing so.



For the glossary section:
Limited: Some cumulative effects are forbidden by the rules. For instance, during a bleed action, an action modifier card that would increase the bleed amount cannot be played if one is already doing so. Similarly, a minion cannot use more than one card or effect (a source) to gain additional strikes per round of combat.

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20 Oct 2021 12:40 #103614 by Bloodartist
Indeed. The issue with rulebook passage
"During a bleed action, a minion cannot play more than one action modifier card to increase the bleed amount. This rule is reminded on those cards by the “(limited)” card text."

Is that this text implies limited +bleed modifier is a minion-specific thing. If this was correct, the second minion who used mask of thousand faces should be able to play the same action modifier increasing the bleed, for the same reason they can play second lost in crowds. Its not the same minion.

I assume this is an oversight, and the text should actually refer to the action (still the same action in Mask case) instead of the minion.

A heretic is a man who sees with his own eyes.
—Gotthold Ephraim Lessing



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