file Charming Lobby + a political action card (KRC)

05 Jul 2022 09:22 #105628 by inm8
Thanks for your answers and for taking the time to read through the post Ankha.

My confusion comes from me making a distinction between "a card being played" vs "a card being played to X" (similar to the distinction made between "lock the minion" vs "lock the minion to X) where also X is defined to be triggered by the action itself and not a combination of cards being played which has been ruled to be the case invalidating the distinction for "played" cards.

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06 Jul 2022 06:41 - 06 Jul 2022 07:47 #105637 by Bloodartist

CL doesn't provide a vote since it's not a PA card.


Charming lobby IS a political action, since it directly states it in its own cardtext.
As I see it, I think the design intent is that CL is a political action that's referendum you can replace with another cards referendum text.

In my opinion it is charming lobby that is returned to hand, since it is a political action card that is used to call the referendum, thus satisfying all the criteria of DT. The other PA card would go to ash heap.

Note that it is NOT the PA card in hand that is used to call the referendum. Because of this I believe CL should be returned to hand, or, if for some weirdo alternate universe reason CL is not interpreted to be a political action card, then nothing is returned to hand. But under no circumstances should the referred PA card be returned to hand, since it is not the one being used to call the referendum, as DT requires.


A heretic is a man who sees with his own eyes.
—Gotthold Ephraim Lessing



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Last edit: 06 Jul 2022 07:47 by Bloodartist.

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06 Jul 2022 08:16 #105639 by Ankha

CL doesn't provide a vote since it's not a PA card.


Charming lobby IS a political action, since it directly states it in its own cardtext.
As I see it, I think the design intent is that CL is a political action that's referendum you can replace with another cards referendum text.


See point 5 in my previous answer, and the provided links.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

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06 Jul 2022 09:53 - 06 Jul 2022 09:53 #105645 by Bloodartist

5) Is Charming Lobby a political action card or is it an action card enabling a political action?

The latter.
"political action cards" are identified with the political action icon.


Card text

Golden rule.

A heretic is a man who sees with his own eyes.
—Gotthold Ephraim Lessing



Last edit: 06 Jul 2022 09:53 by Bloodartist.

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06 Jul 2022 12:46 #105649 by KoRneeshon

5) Is Charming Lobby a political action card or is it an action card enabling a political action?

The latter.
"political action cards" are identified with the political action icon.


Card text

Golden rule.


You still seem to not see the difference between political action card (the one with an appropriate icon) and political action - something executed from CL, political action card or, say, Black Forest Base or Dmitra ability etc. Ankha explained it in this topic quite well.

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06 Jul 2022 15:09 #105658 by inm8

Charming lobby IS a political action, since it directly states it in its own cardtext.
As I see it, I think the design intent is that CL is a political action that's referendum you can replace with another cards referendum text.

In my opinion it is charming lobby that is returned to hand, since it is a political action card that is used to call the referendum, thus satisfying all the criteria of DT. The other PA card would go to ash heap.


Don´t know if this helps knowing you are already upset with me (which wasn´t at all my intent) about this topic

There are numerous rulings saying that the cards Charming Lobby and Bujo aren´t "political action cards" but merely action cards that allow a "political action" to be taken.

groups.google.com/g/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/c/enxwleC-ZKw/m/ppLrzdqH1ooJ
groups.google.com/g/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/c/9HtmVwBkGdE/m/YHEVLeB7Lj4J
groups.google.com/g/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/c/fDl3t2lJ3Pc/m/pdmWZOwllPMJ

Action cards are any cards with the :action: icon i.e :action:, :action: :ally:, :action: :political:, etc.
where recruit action cards only are the ones with these icons :action: :ally:
and political action cards are only the ones with these icos :action: :political:

Here is a link explaining that when there is a card type defined (and an icon) the text doesn´t overrule that (the icon being on the card just as the text).

I do agree that there is some inconsistency in the definition of card types that are not covered by the rules e.g. Drawing Out the Beast is a combat :combat: card but also considered a Frenzy card which isn't a defined type but referenced a lot by other cards.

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