file As predicted by somebody (lol) shit hit the fan again

24 Nov 2018 13:31 #92001 by jamesatzephyr

BenPeal wrote:

See also: the Bloodlines aren't designed in the same way as a full clan, because when something is different it makes sense to consider its differences in context.


When Mike and I were designing Lost Kindred, we had a "full clan" approach rather than the original "companion clan" approach in the first Bloodlines set.


I didn't mean "treat them as sidekicks". I meant more: you only have a half-dozen or so vampires who can go together, with your key discipline. You wouldn't design the overall package for, say, Salubri antitribu and Valeren in the same way as you would for Toreador who have 20-something vampires of their own in most groups, a similar number of Toreador antitribu, and large cross-over potential with clans that share disciplines with them, where vampires have appropriate off-clan disciplines, useful specials etc.

Like, any time someone designs a Dementation card, a legitimate and sensible review process might include judging it against the capabilities of a weenie Dementation deck, that can include, say, 10-12 different, small-medium vampires with Dementation, flip them out quickly, and go. So what happens if someone uses a hypothetical new card in that situation? Will it be abusive, will it be disruptive etc? When designing a new, say, Thanatosis card, the same considerations don't apply - there aren't intended to be lots of Samedi, there aren't intended to be lots of vampires with Thanatosis, every group pair includes at least some fatties, so your possible crypts looks very different - much more double and trebling up required, far fewer options, harder to cast off a vampire whose design is awkward for you because there aren't many alternatives. So the process of balancing cards and strategies for the Samedi would take those sorts of differences into account at one end of the spectrum, and the Toreador/!Toreador with huge dollops of cel/pre available elsewhere at the other end, and a bunch of other clans at different points along that spectrum.
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25 Nov 2018 23:26 #92004 by Lönkka
"Usable only by Sabbat Toreador"
"&
"Usable only by Camarilla Todearor"

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26 Nov 2018 05:51 - 26 Nov 2018 05:52 #92008 by ReverendRevolver

Lönkka wrote: "Usable only by Sabbat Toreador"
"&
"Usable only by Camarilla Todearor"


Palla Grande
Toreador

Unique master.
Put this card in play and put 3 debauchery counters on it. Sabbat Toreador get +1 bleed. Remove a debauchery counter from this card at the end of each of your turns. Burn this card if it has no counters.

Aching Beauty
Master

Toreador

[2 Pool]

Master.
Put this card on a non-Sabbat Toreador. If this Toreador is blocked, the controller of the blocking minion burns 1 pool (before combat occurs, if any).

It's not hard, but the question is, do we keep the antitribbu ftom the good cards like New Carthage, Madness Network, and TGB? Obviously all of those need to work on indy and Anarch. Then we look down the other rabbit hole; should we just keep certain (palla grande) cards Sabbat only and make all others fair game? Demonstration, Ephor, Island of Yairos, directorate assembly, and ventrue headquarters dont seem problematic really. Aching beauty, childing muse, enchanted marionette, are whatever. The only oddball stuff would be like Death seeker for Salubri.

I think now the time for such talks though.
Last edit: 26 Nov 2018 05:52 by ReverendRevolver.
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26 Nov 2018 05:54 #92009 by Klaital
CbN only has Lasombra, no other clans, those will come in later books, it seems they are putting one clan per book.

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26 Nov 2018 18:22 #92027 by DJHedgehog
R E B O O T V T E S
E
B
O
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V
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27 Nov 2018 04:33 #92035 by self biased
doing away with the antitribu clans would make the game much easier to distribute. Clan packs, and then politics packs.

and honestly, is there a driving need in the game to have praxis seizure and Crusade cards? couldn't these also be consolidated?

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