map-pin Rules Team Rulings - RTR 11/05/2018

22 May 2018 14:39 #87315 by ReverendRevolver
Advanced takes precedent over base when they conflict. Somerge dominique, germaine, etc, get an anarch with the texts of base and adv.

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22 May 2018 15:04 - 22 May 2018 15:04 #87317 by Ankha

PetriWessman wrote: About "Anarch is now a sect": (and sorry if this has been discussed before, if so I've missed if)

Does this change how merging anarch vampires works?

Say that the advanced version of Vampire X is "Independent". If I have the base version of X and make it Anarch, and then later merge the superior version, does it lose the Anarch status (now sect)? Or is Independent treated the same as Anarch in this case also?

The Anarch sect would be lost, and the vampire would become Independent instead.

What was the vampire you were thinking of?

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Last edit: 22 May 2018 15:04 by Ankha.

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22 May 2018 15:43 - 22 May 2018 15:56 #87321 by ReverendRevolver
Did he mean the base wasn't printed as Anarch?

Adv/merge from rulebook:
The particulars of this merge are as follows. The counters and cards on the vampire remain. The advancement and the base card are treated as a single vampire card, even if sent to the uncontrolled region somehow, until the vampire is burned. Any effects in play that targeted the vampire now target the merged version.
(I bolded important part)
When merged, the text on the base card still applies, but the rest of the card is ignored (capacity, Disciplines, etc.). The advancement card applies in full. If the advancement card conflictsiconmiscmergedold with the base card (a different sect, for example), the advancement card has precedence. Some merged cards have an additional effect that only applies if the card is merged with its base card. Such an effect is identified in the card text by a "merged" icon.

The advanced vampire (merged or not) will contest other copies of the same vampire (advanced or not) in play, as usual.

Now, rulebook doesn't state that you get an anarch counter from the cardless action, but most other ways to be anarch give a card or counter.
So, unsure about the cardless action, but unless there's a missing "burn this if the vampire changes sects" I think you change sects. Not sure about non permanent stuff, twilight camp and cardless action, but relatively sure you change sects.(since the merge ot adv text applies.)basically you have the trait or its printed, adv or merge replaces it. If you have cards or counters, they burn.
Again, important what crypt card you're asking about.
Skimming stuff, if you had a Beckett, Tariq, etc and merging makes you independent, you are no longer anarch.

*edit* I just edited like 6 times replacing my auto correct with "cardless" instead of "careless ".......
Last edit: 22 May 2018 15:56 by ReverendRevolver.

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22 May 2018 17:08 #87327 by PetriWessman

Ankha wrote: The Anarch sect would be lost, and the vampire would become Independent instead.

What was the vampire you were thinking of?


Advanced Enzo Giovanni, for example. But there may be others, haven't checked.

So ok, this ruling changes what happens in this case for Enzo, at least. Previously the sect would stay Independent and Enzo would retain Anarch status. Now that goes away.

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22 May 2018 17:29 - 22 May 2018 17:37 #87329 by Bloodartist

PetriWessman wrote: Advanced Enzo Giovanni, for example. But there may be others, haven't checked.



Ambrogino Giovanni, Beckett, Ivan Krenyenko, Jack Dawson, Jan Pieterzoon, Kemintiri (?), Lambach, Menele, Nergal, Petaniqua, Tariq the silent.

If I'm not mistaken.. If basic version of these vampires would acquire anarch status, they would lose it upon merging according to the new rule?

If I make advanced version of an independent vampire anarch, and then merge it with basic version, is the "independent" status re-applied or does the vampire remain anarch?

"If a man wanders into a tiger's domain, it may result in his being devoured.
And so it has."
-- Pisha, VtM:B

Last edit: 22 May 2018 17:37 by Bloodartist.

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22 May 2018 17:53 #87330 by kschaefer

Bloodartist wrote: If I make advanced version of an independent vampire anarch, and then merge it with basic version, is the "independent" status re-applied or does the vampire remain anarch?


If the merged version has a sect designation, then that will apply, cf. Tariq, the Silent.

Play Tariq, the Silent (Adv), go Anarch. Merge him, and he'll be Independent because the merge text has a sect designation.

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