Proxies and the VEKN

Gargoylee wrote:

Both Ashur Tablets and Villeins are available for purchase on Ebay and, as others have expressed on this forum and other forums, for trade.

I just checked. 3 Auctions for Ashur Tablets going on
One ends in 10 hours or so, with 39 USD for 3 Ashurs.

Reality check: Ashur Tablets is a common. And if you want to build a deck with it, you need multiples of 3 - most likely 6 or 9.

You really think new players are likely to stick to VTES if commons cost more than 10 USD?

Gargoylee wrote:

Unfortunately this fallacy comes up again and again in this debate. Equal access to cards does not achieve competitive parity.

Please remove my necessity to work so that I have more hours to spend playing and testing decks. Please support my dependents so that I don't have to and can have the same hours as somebody without dependents to build effective decks and play the game.

Seriously though, VTES is a CCG. If you don't like that fact, buy the rights to VTES and change that fact.

I'm not sure why you can't see the difference. You pointed out a couple of factors that could affect skill and/or performance. Why should card availability be one of those factors? It reflects nothing about player skill or intelligence, just how much time and money they've spent acquiring cards.

And who cares if people with more time are better players? Don't professional football players excel at their game because of dedication and training? But they all play with the same balls...

And to your last point: it no longer needs to be a CCG. Surely you can mentally separate the game from the way it is packaged and sold?

Amenophobis wrote:

Gargoylee wrote:

Both Ashur Tablets and Villeins are available for purchase on Ebay and, as others have expressed on this forum and other forums, for trade.

I just checked. 3 Auctions for Ashur Tablets going on
One ends in 10 hours or so, with 39 USD for 3 Ashurs.

Reality check: Ashur Tablets is a common. And if you want to build a deck with it, you need multiples of 3 - most likely 6 or 9.

You really think new players are likely to stick to VTES if commons cost more than 10 USD?

Reality check. If I am willing to spend $75 USD to attend a convention at which the North American Championship is held and the travel expense and the hotel costs, 10 USD for a card which people keep claiming is a necessity for certain decks (which I can at least accept for Ashur Tablets) is peanuts.

Gargoylee wrote:

Unfortunately this fallacy comes up again and again in this debate. Equal access to cards does not achieve competitive parity.

Please remove my necessity to work so that I have more hours to spend playing and testing decks. Please support my dependents so that I don't have to and can have the same hours as somebody without dependents to build effective decks and play the game.

I would love to help you play more. I probably can't. It's better to focus on improvements that can be made.

Seriously though, VTES is a CCG. If you don't like that fact, buy the rights to VTES and change that fact.

The matter of whether we need to own the game to legally use proxies is still waiting for a definitive answer. If we don't then we obviously don't have to buy the game to change that fact.

Suoli wrote:

The matter of whether we need to own the game to legally use proxies is still waiting for a definitive answer. If we don't then we obviously don't have to buy the game to change that fact.

That was already answered at 1065.

Printing proxies violates copyright.

For greater clarification, according to the U.S. Copyright Office: the owner of the copyright has the "EXCLUSIVE" rights to reproduction of the work - subject to sections 107-122 of the Copy Right Act 1976 as amended.

Sections 107 -122 can be found here www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#106

Gargoylee wrote:

For greater clarification, according to the U.S. Copyright Office: the owner of the copyright has the "EXCLUSIVE" rights to reproduction of the work - subject to sections 107-122 of the Copy Right Act 1976 as amended.

Sections 107 -122 can be found here www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html#106

Thank you for the link. Still, it's not clear whether the law applies equally to cards printed for profit by an online printer, a photocopy made for free and for personal use, a piece of paper with card text on it and a Minion Tap with Villein scribbled over it. Furthermore, proxies have been used in CCG's before, sometimes in sanctioned tournaments. I've never heard of legal action resulting from it.