Library card redesign

It'd be pretty easy to ask an artist to put some margins in around the subject so that it can be properly scaled in.

I can see where people are getting confused, because it looks like a full bleed, but it isn't. The computer is filling in some empty space with parts of the picture. I think I'd rather see more picture than a big honkin text box.

self wrote:

It'd be pretty easy to ask an artist to put some margins in around the subject so that it can be properly scaled in.

I can see where people are getting confused, because it looks like a full bleed, but it isn't. The computer is filling in some empty space with parts of the picture. I think I'd rather see more picture than a big honkin text box.

Bigger picture is totally better.

The new cards can now be reviewed / tested by everyone here: amaranth.vtes.co.nz/ (posting here for completeness)

Ke. wrote:

Damnans wrote:

1. Some library cards look like crypt cards (see Bum's Rush below). I think it is important that both main card types can be easily distinguished from each other.

I've never heard of a player being confused by crypt and library cards — they occupy completely different physical spaces.

They're completely different card types with mechanics different enough that they warrant their own decks. I'm of the opinion that they deserve different layouts. I also believe that the current approach to artwork - portrait for crypt, landscape for library - is very effective for this purpose.

Ke. wrote:

Damnans wrote:

2. The amount of text space you gain by overlapping the side bar with the text boxes is, in my opinion, wasted again with the use of the requirement symbols in a way that keeps the alignment of the text where it was with the official layout.

The amount of text area available is * far * greater than the current cards.

Just because you freed up space doesn't mean you should waste it all over again.

Ke. wrote:

Damnans wrote:

3. The use of different font sizes in the various text boxes does not look professional.

There is only the possibility of 2 different font sizes in card text — and that only occurs when there is an opportunity to uniformly increase font size without increasing the size of the box / wrapping text.

I agree with Gines that it looks sloppy and unprofessional. It's an obvious fudging of the text box rules.

As a card designer, I think the correct solution is to not design cards that use that much text in the first place. If the game were to come back in print, I'd push for eliminating cards with overly-long text.

Ke. wrote:

Damnans wrote:

4. The area for the artwork should not be variable, because, in order to produce optimal results, artists need to know how their illustrations are going to look on the final card.

This design was designed to work with current artwork and it does.

I and artists I've spoken with disagree. From an aesthetic perspective, I think the current library layout is superior. I do think you've highlighted some functional issues that need to be addressed, and I agree that the sidebar stripe of the current layout wastes space that could be used towards increasing the font size.

I think the crypt layout needs work, but I like the overall concept. Artists I've spoken with have had mixed feelings about it. It does look cleaner and fresher, and it's better suited to a portrait layout (as opposed to landscape layout) than library cards. However, it doesn't work well with a lot of existing crypt portraits, particularly those with very simple/patternless/monochromatic backgrounds. If the artwork is purposefully made with the new layout in mind, it can look great - the original concept pieces using the John Van Fleet artwork are great examples.

Ke. wrote:

Again we are never going to achieve 100% perfection without someone manually laying out and sourcing artwork for all 3700 cards — and that is unlikely to happen any time soon.

Have a fixed size for the artwork. Problem 100% solved. Rather, problem currently non-existent.

BenPeal wrote:

They're completely different card types with mechanics different enough that they warrant their own decks. I'm of the opinion that they deserve different layouts. I also believe that the current approach to artwork - portrait for crypt, landscape for library - is very effective for this purpose.

Yes, I agree that the layout should be different — however I also believe they currently are. I can try a few variations here to see how this can be improved.

BenPeal wrote:

Just because you freed up space doesn't mean you should waste it all over again.

The space is not wasted; it's used to differentiate between requirements and effects — something the current layout does very poorly.

BenPeal wrote:

I agree with Gines that it looks sloppy and unprofessional. It's an obvious fudging of the text box rules.

There is no fudging; it's an applied rule. Easily switched on or off.

The same goes for the part that maximises the font size across the entire card.

I would argue that we should make use of space when available and increase the font size to improve readability. If that must apply to all of the text then fine; however to stick to the same font across all card text is definitely counter productive from a readability perspective.

BenPeal wrote:

As a card designer, I think the correct solution is to not design cards that use that much text in the first place. If the game were to come back in print, I'd push for eliminating cards with overly-long text.

This is great; however it's not the current reality. The goal here is accommodate the current cards — not redesign the game (although that's a great longer term goal).

With that in mind we need to account for large amounts of text.

BenPeal wrote:

I do think you've highlighted some functional issues that need to be addressed, and I agree that the sidebar stripe of the current layout wastes space that could be used towards increasing the font size.

Part of the issue here is the ratio of the artwork. It's barely landscape, the ratio is 1:15 which means it's difficult place without consuming vast amounts of text space. So conversely, the sidebar actually frees up space for text. If the artwork had a wider aspect ratio, we would have far more options. See below for example:



The goal here was to refresh the design without completely changing it; so it would be familiar to current players, yet easier for new players. The new design is supposed to be similar enough to the current cards so they can also be used with the current cards (we're using them locally already).

If it was to completely redesign from scratch then versions like Alt 2 and Alt 3 start to become a possibility. However with a 7+ hand size there are two rules which can not be broken:

1. Card type must be clear in hand (when fanned)
2. First few letters of card name must be visible in hand (when fanned)

This limits the design options further.

If I get a chance; I'll knock up some variations in the templating system. The great thing about the system is once it's done for one card; it's done for them all...

I had some time last night to explore an idea. I'll throw in more in a few days, but right now i've got a house full of nerds to entertain. treat this as a super rough sketch.