Card name change suggestion

The card in question hasn't been printed in over 20 years. Nearly every copy of it is sealed away in in a box and never sees the light of day, because it's such a bad card no one plays with it. Re-naming a card would require reprinting it, which no one has any interest in doing for this particular one (again, because it's so useless). If your intention was seriously (including a meme in your initial post really doesn't lead itself to seriousness) to eliminate offensive terminology (of which this is questionable, at best) from the game; congratulations, you just achieved the opposite and re-introduced it to everyone.

So much this @1uck

I was wondering if we'd get to "People who talk about racism are the REAL racists!"

Hooray...?

1uck wrote:

The card in question hasn't been printed in over 20 years. Nearly every copy of it is sealed away in in a box and never sees the light of day, because it's such a bad card no one plays with it. Re-naming a card would require reprinting it, which no one has any interest in doing for this particular one (again, because it's so useless). If your intention was seriously (including a meme in your initial post really doesn't lead itself to seriousness) to eliminate offensive terminology (of which this is questionable, at best) from the game; congratulations, you just achieved the opposite and re-introduced it to everyone.

The card in question is still in the card lists on the website, so it's still there for all to see. I'm not so sure that renaming a defunct card requires it being reprinted; the powers that be can do whatever they want on the matter. Besides, if the card's so worthless, why fight so hard to keep the name the same? That's baffling to me.

As it's evident that there's a significant portion of people out there who are wholly ignorant of the racist origins of the word 'Gypsy,' the meme struck me as appropriate because of the message that most people probably don't want to unknowingly use a racial slur; the part where it states 'I know you're not doing it maliciously.' I wanted to give people the benefit of the doubt.

If you had a friend of some ethnic group, and they asked you to not use a word they considered offensive, would you do it? Or would you keep using the word?

Lech wrote:

It's also woefully underrepresented. Is there any Prince/Archbishop/Cardinal from South America? What about eastern Europe, like for example Moscow, Warsaw, Bucarest ? Nope, only Prague. India ? Not much. At least laibon have africa covered. So it IS mostly North Atlantic of Darkness (covering mostly old NATO and some of it's unofficial colonies).

It's not a deliberate slight;

No matter what, we are based on source material. Said source material is incredibly rich in dealing with Russia and former Soviet satellite countries. Prague hell, that's historically had things relevant to stories at large, and thus was a component of vtmDA, and the first 1/4 of the setting for VTMR for pc. Berlin had 2 princes at once, and still has both a prince and an archbishop even after the wall fell like 30 years ago.
South America is SHIT for established sects. Why? Consistantly being home of tons of Garou and fera, being a bastion of infernalist ancients, being home to ancient methuselahs long hidden under the equator before other kindred crossed the ocean, and also more recently being host to its "indigenous " bloodlines referred to as the drowned legacies, surging up to route cam and sabbat influence.

Now, Rio is a different story, where Cam and Sabbat in fact exist in tandem with shockingly little conflict.

Russia was mystically sealed from the outside world by forces that made vampires who entered the "curtain of shadows " stuck and unable to leave, until Baba Yaga was killed by a Nictuku.

Now, anarchs replaced princes with barons before and during the removal of the czar from power. They maintained this setup with ONE exception until they were shut down by Baba Yaga somewhat openly ruling the place.
St Petersburgs prince Nicolai is a ventrue whi loves the city. The anarch Brujah took out his site and installed him to essentially put up a front of everything being ok, as the city was a gateway of sorts. For his part, he hated the murder of his sire and intends to have his vengeance in part by outliving the murderers.

Nearly ALL of this is from Becketts Jyhad Diaries, a V20 book, with some being from far older sources.

Like it or not, we are rooted in the source material. Dig a little and submit ideas. I promise its easier and has more validity than other paths.

Also, India is traditionally Ravnos land, where they are the locals not wandering tricksters. They war with the KotE constantly.
Laibon are localized to sub saharan Africa, with Guruhi representing much more of the ruling class and magagi thsn game balance allows showing in vtes. If you compile all ventrue to non ventrue princes in source materials and get that ratio(9to1ish) that's similar to guruhi yo non guruhi magagi.

Northern Africa has hosted cam and Sabbat for ages. The first and second cities existed around the fertile crescent, with clans spreading from there, nominally.

So, I concede underrepresented things you mentioned, but have explained enough about the areas to theoretically give you ideas on how to submit remedies.

self wrote:

Malachy wrote:

Self biased! I understand you have some sort of inner compulsion to fight racism, but trust me, here is none! That game is outside any of this 21th century snowflake pride stuff, please keep it that way. Play the game for what it is... A cardgame originated in a roleplaying game of the '90s, using its terminology and background... Word of Darkness... a much grimmer and darker reflection of our world... ring a bell?

please explain to me how using racist terminology is essential to the overall feel and tone of the game?

Racist terminology is not, originality is. But having a card named "Gypsies" created in the ninties, when people were expected to use brain cells to figure out it is not racist to depict an ethnical group without the slightest derogatory sense. Who... in their right mind... could find that card offensive??? You explain this to me, Self biased. It's like banning old movies because all the lead roles played by white, heterosexual poeple... Should I feel rightfully offended when a boardgame invented in Asia doesn't have white figures?