A proposition to change Lilith's Blessing and Anthelios

Thanks for the replies!

First of all, I was aiming at subtle and concrete changes for exactly those reasons: being subtle confuses as little as possible, and concrete so that the designers wouldn't have to ponder what was the proposition.

About Villein: yeah, I would've liked to see it changed when it first appeared. At the moment it has already gone through a simple and effective errata to make it reasonable again. Change in games like these, and in games as a whole, and in life as a whole, are inevitable and good. Change is good. It makes things stay alive. This is why I harbour no ill will against Villein.

Lilith's, however, was a last addition to a game that was going to get killed, and possibly wasn't even meant as an addition as such. I don't really know, others might know better. Anyways, it's been here for a short time (relatively), and doing something about it would change stuff too much. Banning? Not really a realistic option here, I think.

Changing Lilith to work in the Untap phase sounds cool, actually, and might be easy to errata with a single word, exactly like adding 'unique'. Either version would fix a whole lotta problems - the 'untap phase' clause even more so, to be honest.

I wouldn't propose global rules changes. Only really subtle things to fix real and very concentrated problems. Adding to global rules have the danger of confusion and might create a lot of collateral damage. I'd rather hit cards - and a VERY FEW at that!

@Ankha, it's a huge difference. Also, it's not 3 blood - it's actually at least 4 pool. You either Villein to 1 blood (which few people would dare to do, 'cause you need blood to do stuff), or with Lilith's villein to 0 blood, then gain 3 blood, which can be used to act, to bloat back with vessel/blood doll... It's a lot more than 3 blood, to be honest.

@Kevin, Villein is rare. Sad but true. Starting players here need to pay roughly $10 in ebay for a single Villein, or play Minion Taps. And, honestly, Villein is by far superior in many cases. I think we all agree on that. And before we go to the argument over newcomers and if they're fiction or not; no, they're real in this town.

Also for all of this to happen, you need to actually draw your lilith's blessing and waste one turns mpa and a pool playing it. And to get it early reliably you need to play quite a few copies, the extras which will be dead draws later in the game. Most of the liliths blessing is too good arguments tend to assume you always get it to starting hand.

Klaital wrote:

Most of the liliths blessing is too good arguments tend to assume you always get it to starting hand.

Which mean Lillith is even worse for the game.

Like Giant blood, the problem is not that it will make you win every game. It's that, from time to time, it will make you gain 8 or 11 pool for next to nothing, and that's way too much even for something unreliable.

Of course, unlike Giant Blood, it tend to be very useable even when you draw it late, because a MPA for a minion action (by avoiding a mandatory hunt) is something that can win games.

(which make me think that uniqueness on Lillith may well not change thing that much, since it's not that often played in more than x1)

Just checking: does everybody know that you don't shuffle your deck after using Lilith's Blessing? I can't remember if it's been discussed on the forum, and I was surprised when someone pointed it out to me.

I guess Lilith gives you perfect knowledge of the future along with 3 blood and a skill card.

AaronC wrote:

Just checking: does everybody know that you don't shuffle your deck after using Lilith's Blessing? I can't remember if it's been discussed on the forum, and I was surprised when someone pointed it out to me.

Under general rulings:

"If an effect causes you to search your library or crypt, shuffle that deck afterward"

I don't know who told you you don't shuffle, but they were wrong. You shuffle after any search effect.

General wrote:

If an effect causes you to search your library or crypt, shuffle that deck afterward. [LSJ 20040518]