file Card idea: Trust no One

17 Aug 2011 06:49 - 17 Aug 2011 06:49 #8328 by Kraus
Replied by Kraus on topic Re: Card idea: Trust no One

It's not a "need", except maybe for the new options it brings. Likewise, was there a "need" for Neonate Breach?

Not really, nor was there exactly for Scourge of the Enochians. I feel that the latter was a poor addition to the game.

Anyways, if there is no need for a hoser card (those exist already, for the same offense even), I don't think there really is need to print one. No need really means no need, if you ask me.

I actually blogged about the matter a wee bit. :) Not very cohesive, ground breaking or even well written I suppose, but first blog posts are always first.

So yeah, I don't think there is need for an ally hoser that does exactly that: kills the ally player, not the allies. Over n' out! :)

Have fun!

"Oh, to the Hades with the manners! He's a complete bastard, and calling him that insults bastards everywhere!"
-Nalia De-Arnise

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Last edit: 17 Aug 2011 06:49 by Kraus.

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17 Aug 2011 06:49 #8329 by jhattara
Ancilla Empowerment and Anarchist Uprising already work against allies. There is no need for this kind of card.

:splat: Jussi Hattara :splat:
:vtes: Webmaster Extraordinaire :vtes:
Finnish :POT: Politics!
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17 Aug 2011 07:34 #8330 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: Card idea: Trust no One

Ancilla Empowerment and Anarchist Uprising already work against allies. There is no need for this kind of card.

No offense meant, but I think the "need" factor of the cards in this section should not be taken into account. This is a sand-box area, the only things that should matter are:
- is the card balanced?
- is it interesting?
+ the various debates it may generate, such as those about allies (most interesting).

The cards won't be printed anyway. New cards are never needed, we can (and are forced to) play with whatever cards are printed today. So saying a fan-card is not needed is nonsensical.

Prince of Paris, France
Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director

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17 Aug 2011 08:31 #8335 by Juggernaut1981
Is the card balanced?
This card does nothing against weenie vampire decks, but expressly penalises ally decks. I have no real problem with Ancilla Empowerment or Anarchist Uprising, since they are basically a carpet-bomb... indiscriminate and also hurt the user of the card. Neonate Breach I think was an unneccessary card (like Jussi).

Is it an interesting card?
Not really no. I can quickly think of much better ally-crippling cards that do not out-and-out destroy the player. This is basically just an Ancilla Empowerment for Allies only, and considering there is already a "re-buy your ally card" out there it is again unneccessary.


So to show at least one simple way to penalise allies without destroying a player 'randomly' playing an Ally deck Cross table...

Grand Feast
Political Action
Choose any number of Methuselahs who control a ready Ally. Each ally controlled by the target Methuselahs loses 1 life and for each ally you may give 1 blood to a vampire you control from the blood bank; a vampire can only receive 1 blood from this action. Only one Grand Feast may be played during a minion phase.

:bruj::CEL::POT::PRE::tha: Baron of Sydney, Australia, 418
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17 Aug 2011 09:11 #8338 by Mael
Replied by Mael on topic Re: Card idea: Trust no One

FYI, you cannot block Piper.

Setup required to make people anarch, plenty of solutions to deal with this.

I can't think of any practical solutions to prevent Anarch Convert

The solutions are to deal with the Piper, they include wash, sudden reversal, beating up the anarch, banishment, etc.

You cannot block Antonio's special.

He can fetch one useful ally with his ability. That ally has no intrinsic stealth or intercept.

+1 intercept from Unmasking

So now you're talking about a 3 card combo and 2 pool to create a chump blocker/bleeder. They're good and all, but they don't win games on their own.

Good luck blocking a turn 2 Garou between Form of Mist and Earth Control

Since there are exactly two vampires in the game who can recruit Renegade Garou and can play Form of Mist at superior on turn 2, it's not something I'm going to get overly concerned about.

sixteen vampires with Info Hwy or Zillah's valley. twenty more if you play a protean discipline card on turn 2.

Good luck reliably pulling that off in turn 2. If you can build a deck to do this, I'll happily let you have your Garou.

No offense meant, but I think the "need" factor of the cards in this section should not be taken into account. This is a sand-box area, the only things that should matter are:
- is the card balanced?

No.

- is it interesting?

No, because it hurts the diversity of the game.

+ the various debates it may generate, such as those about allies (most interesting).

Ok, I'll grant you that there has been interesting discussion generated :)

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17 Aug 2011 09:22 - 17 Aug 2011 09:22 #8341 by Ankha
Replied by Ankha on topic Re: Card idea: Trust no One

You cannot block Antonio's special.

He can fetch one useful ally with his ability. That ally has no intrinsic stealth or intercept.

+1 intercept from Unmasking

So now you're talking about a 3 card combo and 2 pool to create a chump blocker/bleeder. They're good and all, but they don't win games on their own.

Sorry to disturb, but I've seen many times a Nephandus deck win. They can lock down completely some decks (1 stealth vote, or decks without strong combat. TV doesn't work against them), and they bleed as swell as a vampire swarm.

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Ratings Coordinator, Rules Director
Last edit: 17 Aug 2011 09:22 by Ankha.

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