file A proposition to change Lilith's Blessing and Anthelios

16 Dec 2012 16:29 #42985 by ReverendRevolver

I agree there are many individual Villeins in circulation, but not nearly enough to meet demand (as the eBay price of Villein indicates).

I can get, literally, 100 or more Villein in the next 24 hours. I asked around, did a little polling, and very, very few players said that they'd not sell me lots of Villein for {some amount of monies}.

To keep mis-defining "demand", "scarcity", "rare", "not nearly enough" and other phrases like it make me sad, because they only make players believe that Villein aren't available, when they clearly are. and then they don't look on eBay, don't ask around, don't get Villein, and eventually get frustrated with the entire situation when they don't need to be.

I'm exiting this now, and thanks for the support, Jeff :)


This argument has turned to being about semantics. Against kevin, yes, im sure it is hard for anyone who didnt buy several httb precons or at least a box of kot boosters to have acquired villeins without trading cards that they would have preferred hanging on to, or some amount of currency for them. Same with deep song, eyes of argus, and to a lesser extent, rego motus. They are hard to get cards that were staples within a year of first being printed and thus everyone wanted/wants a stockpile. They were only reprinted twice and the game went out of print.

Id lime to have more myself. Of all 3 Such cards.

But they are not scarce currently. Anyone who wants them can buy them ir trade for them. Monetarily, i think villeini worth $10 and liquidation~$20-$17. But players who need the latter will normally trade 2 villein and a few cheaper cards to acquire liquidations.

Pod will solve this issue, but id call villein a sought after card rather than scarce, since the price doesnt rival things that are very scarce, like sirens lure or charisma. In fact, the one or two per box cards like preturnatural strength, summon history, or unmasking (cog was harder to get from what ive been told) are scarce. By the definitions provided, villein was less scarce. Its valuable, but was when kot was still in print, so im not seeing the problem acquiring it. Its less than charisma. Would someone trade me a charisma for a villein? Just curious.


Other topic: jake is way harder to get than liliths, and jake can block. Ive never owned him, never underestimate mr washington. He is borderline too good, but if he were as readily available as LB he would be the topic of this argument. I think ill post what i think to be more fair versions of all debatex cards soon, to be flamed as you all want, or agreed with.

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16 Dec 2012 18:51 #42990 by Louhi
@Reyda: What makes Jake so good compared to lilith's is the flexibility. You can either get back 4 blood when in a pinch or you can use him to chump block a key rush or more importantly, he can still block bleeds made with daring the dawn. For pure blood generation maybe they're comparable but that's not the whole picture. At least in my experience/opinion, Jake is the better card.

Lidingö Scourge
The following user(s) said Thank You: Reyda

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16 Dec 2012 21:56 #43007 by Pendargon

@Reyda: What makes Jake so good compared to lilith's is the flexibility. You can either get back 4 blood when in a pinch or you can use him to chump block a key rush or more importantly, he can still block bleeds made with daring the dawn. For pure blood generation maybe they're comparable but that's not the whole picture. At least in my experience/opinion, Jake is the better card.


it is also unique and usable only once

:QUI: :POT: :OBE: :CEL: :OBF: :tore: :assa:

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16 Dec 2012 22:23 #43008 by Klaital

@Reyda: What makes Jake so good compared to lilith's is the flexibility. You can either get back 4 blood when in a pinch or you can use him to chump block a key rush or more importantly, he can still block bleeds made with daring the dawn. For pure blood generation maybe they're comparable but that's not the whole picture. At least in my experience/opinion, Jake is the better card.


it is also unique and usable only once


Nothing prevents you from playing many Jakes if you expect to use the blood gain ability quickly. Like I had 3 or 4 in my Ravnos Tumnimos swarm deck.

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16 Dec 2012 22:54 #43010 by Ohlmann
More importantly since we are talking balance : it can be interacted with, since it's a rushable unique ally without combat skill.

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17 Dec 2012 10:04 #43036 by alek
the easiest and most elegant solution is to ban lilith's blessing. As I heard it's wasn't tested at the time of release and it's stricly overpowered, especially when combined with villein

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