What is missing from VtES?

Hey, Mathusalem,

I'm seeing your enthusiasm and it's hecking great. It takes a lot for the V:tes community to get behind new ideas, sometimes to the point of showing along a long line that the ideas are viable (just look for the full bleed thread). There's also a lot of room for improvement, so don't get discouraged when you get shut down. I don't expect you to go through and read through the archives to see if your ideas were already mentioned in a thirty page thread where there was some lively discussion involved.

That being said, V:TES ain't Magic. V:TES at its core is a game of resource management, with the two basic resources being your Pool, and your Deck. You mentioned wanting to see more Tutoring effects, but with the way the game plays and moves, Tutoring is generally inferior to just playing the cards to cycle them out of your hand.

This is also why Ash Heap shenanigans are probably best limited and why Ashur Tablets are so polarizing. Remember: there is no per card limit in V:TES; just a hard cap on deck size for the number of players in a game. Because in many cases, if you play more cards in an interaction with another player, you'll come out on top. A player in my group has a 200+ card * Enkidu deck that can throw twenty cards an action if there's a combat, and it's fucking awful.

With regard to Politics, you're 20% right, but it feels like you're missing the point, and i'm going to guess that you've only played a few dozen games. I get that you misread the rules initially, but there's still no less politicking in any of the games I've played. Seek out new players and enjoy how their meta is different from yours.

I used to be of your camp when it came to sect, until i realized that a Methuselah of any sect will use whatever tools** at its disposal to thwart its competitors. In my mind, when we sit down at the table we're five Methuselahs who've agreed upon rules to a game. Being ousted isn't death for us, just we're out of this game of violence that we've agreed to play with an arbitrary set of resources, which is SUPER Vampire-y.

I'm against more G1 vamps, but for Advanced versions that aren't awful. There's weird legal reasons they haven't been reprinted, but I am a huge fan of the grouping rule, and think it should be expanded into the library.

_____
* my playgroup had some preposterously stupid house rules when I joined. I've worked hard to get them to play as close to the tournament standard. In fifteen years, I'm still not quite there.

** whatever that methuselah can get its hands on, be it Vampire, Werewolf, or Mage. Side note: Why aren't Formori a thing in VTES?

Ankha wrote:

Group 1 vampires have only one group to pair with, and they are weaker than vampires from other groups (globally speaking). More advanced versions could help, maybe. Or we continue to expand the groups.

So, if we're effectively just going to pretend G1 Vampires don't exist, can we also just pretend Imbued don't exist... Permanently? I'm asking for a friend.

Well I hadn't realized my flamethrower was on.
I'll turn it off.... there.
safety on.

Thanks Kraus and Self biased for your replies.
I'll think about those considerations.
I'll try Ashur's tablets, (i've got a few copies) because at the moment I can't grasp the problem with them.
the system seems quite cumbersome to lay out. of course thirteen cards is a bit of a big deal.
But, the Mtg player in me feels that if they had made a card that had been simpler but was less overwhelming, it would have been stronger and yet less oppressive. so I think it is still a design space that is open.

Try slotting 9 of them in basically any deck with either:

Anson
Cybele
Nana Buruku
Huitzilopotchli
The Parthenon
Liquidation

...or a selection of the above of your choice.

Have fun.

Remember that you can always proxy them with colour prints, and even have the decks be tournament legal in anything less than championships. No worries about that!

thanks ! Will do ! (here I'm quoting Barabus in the famous Bloodlines video game)

9 of them ! I was happy because I had 4 ! no wonder their price went off the roof !